Talking to Professors

Wayne: One of the things I remember a lot is Ed Weinzierl—who’s deceased now, but—we had him for a class called “Maps and Landforms.” And I remember it was in a lecture hall that slanted down to the floor. And Ed was working at the overhead. You remember those…machines? And we were taking some notes and he was going over different landforms and there was two couples down in the front and they were kind of talking. And he kind of looked at them, gave ‘em that stink eye, and they quieted down. Ten minutes later they started chit-chattin’ and he stopped and he just read them the riot act and threw them outta class, said “don’t ever come back.” And that made quite an impression on me. And the next year we took a course through Ed Weinzierl, it’s called “Geomorphology.” And one of the requirements was to have a weekend in the Baraboo Range. And so he drove us to Baraboo, and we studied the landforms and we got to know him very, very, well. And I remember him, the second morning we were there, we got on this landform, it was called the roche moutonnée—it’s a French term. And he had a thing of cigars in his pocket, and he whips ‘em out and he says “anybody for a cigar?” And a bunch of us went up and grabbed a cigar, and we were smoking a cigar and learning a lot about landforms. And I remember that to this day. And we really liked Ed Weinzierl, he’s a very good teacher and made a good impression upon me. Then I had a history professor, and I’m trying to think of his name, but I took a course on Latin American politics. When I was teaching high school at Brookwood High School, where I spent my career and I had to take an extra course and he had me meet him at his house. He lived between the campus and the old Kmart. And it was an election year and he wanted to watch the presidential debate. And so, I met at his house before the debate and we did… a series of readings and we discussed them and then we watched a little bit of the debate and I drove home. But not often do you go to a professor’s house for a class. And I’m trying to remember his name. I’m looking at your list here, see if I can…

Wayne: Well, I don’t see his name here. But anyway, that made quite an impression on me. I thought I was movin’ up the ladder when you got to go to the professor’s house and discuss your homework.

Gavin: So, I guess you really established some good working relationships with quite a few professors?

Wayne: I did, I enjoyed the professors. I thought they were very, very, down-to-earth and they were very good to me. And as a result, I thought I got a little bit more out of the class then you normally would have.

Gavin: And that really helped you succeed in college then?

Wayne: Yep.

Gavin: And then are there any other professors then there that you see that really made an impact on you?

Wayne: Well, I see one John Hoefer. I had John Hoefer for a geography class, and it was a course on—what was the name of the course? I think it was like a cultural geography. And we walk into—he’s kind of a little bit on the unusual side, I would say. And we walked into the class and he looked at us all and he goes “ein bisschen Land und ein bisschen Menschen.” And we looked at him like, “what?” And he said “that’s a little bit of land and a little bit of people,” and that was the basis of the course—and that was day one. About halfway through the semester, we’re in the second floor in Cowley [Hall] and someone came in and whispered in his ear and he looked a little rattled. Come to find out his house was on fire.

Gavin: Really?

Wayne: Yeah, he lived down on State Road, not too far from campus and he always rode this little scooter to school. It was like a 50 cc scooter. It was always down below, we could see it. He finished the class, went out of that building with a little double-step, went down and got on his scooter and tended to his house. He told us about it the next week. It didn’t burn down…but he didn’t leave right away, and I’ll never forget that.

Gavin: Really?

Wayne: Yeah, John Hoefer was his name. I enjoyed him. And Jerry Culver, I mentioned his wife taught anatomy classes, physiology classes, and he was the head of the Geography department for a while. And I would usually meet him down at the [La Crosse] Public Library on 7th Street. He’d be reading the newspapers and he’d be taking a lunch break, and I’d sometimes ride my bike down there and read a magazine or newspaper, or just go take a ride and he was down there practically every day, reading the newspaper at 11:30, 12:00. And I only had him for one class, but I do remember him. And I think my favorite teacher was Robert Wingate.

Gavin: Ok.

Wayne: Robert Wingate, I had a number of classes with him. He’s the one who started that Russian, Soviet Seminar class where they took a trip to Russia. And I remember, as seniors, we went on a field trip to Westby to Tri-State Breeders [Cooperative] and then down along Genoa, and he was talking about the landforms and the configurations of the area and the coulees and then we had a, we physically went in the Tri-State Breeders [Cooperative] for a maybe half-hour. And it was a very nice Saturday afternoon, I remember that. But Bob Wingate still, even after I graduated, would take tickets for football games and was he would be on staff in the stadium, keeping things in line, and even at basketball games, so I got the chance to talk to him twenty, thirty years after I graduated.

Gavin: And he was still doing that at UWL?

Wayne: Correct, correct. I still see him once in a while. Yep. Yeah, even today.

Gavin: Really?

Wayne: Yep. I mentioned this Herman Nelson. I remember him, as a freshman, sophomore, I had a couple classes with him. And he always wore bowties. He was tall, lanky gentleman and we had a class where there’s probably eighty or ninety kids in the class, it was in a lower floor of Cowley [Hall]. It might have been “Weather and Climate,” “Maps and Landforms,” one of those basic courses. And he’d take role and the next day he would call us by our name. He had this photogenic memory, where he could just [Barrett snaps his fingers] come up with the kids’ names like that. I really was kind of amazed by that. This James Parker I had for history. He was a very, very, good professor, enjoyed his work, along with Martin Zanger, those were two, maybe the most popular professors in history during the [1970]s when I was there. Everybody wanted to take their classes.

Gavin: Really?

Wayne: Yeah.

Gavin: So, it was always I guess sort of a race when you had to sign up for them?

Wayne: Correct, correct. Margaret Chew, I only had one class with Margaret Chew, she was quite elderly at the time. She ran our Geography Club for a couple years.

Gavin: Ok.

Wayne: She was kind of the lady who put that together from what I understand. And she’s had quite a interesting life, if you ever read her bio, she’s talked with kings and queens, and ridden camels in the desert with higher-ups, and she’s been all over the world. I don’t think she was ever married, from what I understand, but she had quite a life. But she was quite elderly, even when I was there, I think, but interesting lady, very interesting lady.

Gavin: Now you’d mentioned in our pre-interview meeting about a memory with John Snyder.

Wayne: Yeah, Snyder I remember, he would come into history class and he would have these big boots on with blue jeans rolled way up and he’d have a flannel shirt on. And very, very, just gonna dress the way he wanted, not the way maybe the university people wanted him to dress. And I remember one time, I believe it was him, he came and he had two pistols on his side. They weren’t loaded—you wouldn’t get away with that today—but we were studying the American West and he wanted to show us what a revolver, a Colt really looked like and how it was used by the early settlers and some of the gunslingers. And I remember that quite a bit. It made an impression upon me.

Gavin: I’d imagine.

Ashlyn: Yeah. So, you know, specifically like my Freshman year it was challenging. It's- it's challenging for most students just adjusting to that college life. So, you know, in combination with it being Freshman year and just kind of five years ago already, there's not a ton that I remember class-wise and professor-wise. I remember, you know, struggling a little bit at the start especially in math again, but once I got, you know, to into my core kind of psych classes, my Junior and Senior year, I was really able to form connections with professors, because, you know, you're taking multiple classes with certain professors. But my ceramics professor in particular, Jared Pfeiffer, he, I- I'd say it made the biggest impact on my college career, and I took multiple classes with him outside of ceramics. And I think he just really, you know, proved that well and like, yes, it's harder to have a giant art class, it's not really possible. But he just really, you know, enforced the importance to me, you know, really having a close connection with your professor. You know, more of that like one on one interaction, and I think that really- really made college- college worth it for me, and- and having at least one professor that I was able to make a connection with, it was really exciting.

Alex: Yes, and there are a couple. I want to start up with Jo Arney, who is in my thoughts because I know that she has since passed, and that's hard because she was very instrumental in me being interested in this field. She was my local government—local and state government professor—and that's where I started this journey, I, you know, interned for somebody who I would succeed. I interned for them in college and Jo was my adviser. Dianne Hesselbein was the Representative who held this seat before me. And, so Jo was my adviser when I went and interned for Diane, and then I came back to campus and later on she was my state and local government professor, and years back I look on some of the lessons that she taught and some of the practicalities of what local government is and I used that when I ran for Dane County Board and to which I still serve. And then I ran for State Representative after that, and I think of her and the things that she said and taught and that the lasting impact that she left. Then there are other faculty members, Alan Bigel was always a joy to attend his class. He had a unique way of instructing, which I definitely learned a lot from my time with him. He was a very encouraging faculty member, and really helped develop my writing skills, which I use every day now to write about law. And not having a law degree, that's very helpful for me [laughs] to know. So those are two that stick out in my mind.

Aliyah: Yeah, I would say my Event Management course that I or yeah, the Event Management course, we were planning that Wheels For All tournament. That professor really had an impact on me. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to say names or not. Oh, I can. 

Tiffany: Yes.

Aliyah: Okay, that professor was Dr. Narcatta-Welp, I think she still teaches there. She was one of my favorites, and I still keep in touch with her, you know, on- on Facebook, so that's kind of cool to see what she's up to. But she was one of the professors, I think, that I enjoyed the most there just because she was so personable, and really made sure that you, you know, were learning the content, but also understanding it. But not- didn't just kind of leave you on your own. So I think she was probably one of the most impactful professors that I have throughout college. Going into grad school, I think it was different just because everybody had kind of come from wherever they had come from. And so it was definitely different getting to know those professors. But I did have some that I- I felt like were very helpful, and, you know, they didn't make it feel like school, which was nice. But I would say in undergrad, I think, at La Crosse, just with that smaller class sizes. I mean, not that my classes were very huge in Minnesota, but they were a little bit bigger, I would say, and just the school in general was bigger, so those professors have more classes. but the professors at UW-La Crosse, I think, and Narcatta-Welp, She was probably one of the best that I have ever had. And I think just, you know, being able to, you know, talk with her even outside her office hours, you know, just coming by to say hi, or like get some feedback on a paper. I think she was probably one of the professors I'll remember the most.

Harry: …God I wish I could think of her name, she was a phenomenal teacher. I had a biology teacher for biology, I don’t know if it’s called 101, whatever the intro to biology was, that class I loved. And the thing is I loved all my classes and I don’t say that to be sound sappy cause I do love going to school. I loved the subject. I love learning,  it’s frustrating as hell cause I can’t learn like everybody else does. But I had a biology teacher who was, God what was her name, she was super popular too. But with her help, I squeaked out of that class with a C minus or a D plus. But that was a really positive experience though because she didn’t give up on me. And she constantly helped, and you could go to her for everything. I think we’re going to name a building after her I thought, and they didn’t. She used to sit right at the front of the row for Caper games, the basketball, that was the amateur basketball back then. I don’t know what they call it now or  if they’re even here. But she would sit in the front row. That’s what I remember about her. But I can’t think of her name.

Tiffany: What do you remember about the first classes that you were part of at UWL? What was the academic setting like? What were the academic expectations like? How did you cope, how did you adjust to coursework as a college student at UWL?

Darlene: I can’t say there was a professor who knew my name until about, you know, maybe two or three years into it. Because my classes, I remember a psychology class was over four hundred people in Graff Main Hall.

Tiffany: Oh wow.

Darlene: Any communication was done with our Social Security Numbers. So tests with our Social Security Numbers would be posted outside of the psychology chair office for that psych one hundred class. And then, so I think my memory of the classes were really about going there to get what I could. Sort of in an anonymous way really. [Clears throat] Because I didn’t have a major. In fact, I might have changed my major maybe six times. I was going to be an elementary school teacher and then I was going to be a high school teacher and then I was going to be a sex ed teacher and then I sort of, oh I was going to be something else at one point. It was a big parks and rec school, so I was thinking maybe parks and rec cause then I could be outside. So I didn’t really have a major and so I just kept taking classes that interested me and when I found professors that I could understand and that I liked what they were teaching I would take more classes from those professors. [Clears throat] It sort of is how I landed then in the speech communication department because I really, what resonated most for me were classes about human interaction. And what it is that connects or makes people human in the humanities. It’s how they were taught back then, I think. So that way of going through classes felt disconnected in some way, but I anchored myself with how much it was costing. So I did the math on what the tuition was at the time and I told myself that no matter what I would have to show up to classes and if I learned at least one thing, it didn’t matter if I liked the professor, didn’t like the professor, if they knew who I was or not, I had to show up because this was real money to me. And I figured it out that a two day a week class, like a Tuesday-Thursday class was 17 dollars and 50 cents a class. And so that 17 dollars and 50 cents was real money to me, and if I learned one thing, that was going to be worth it. And so, no matter what, I always dragged myself to class. Attendance was the one that I was going to make sure I did. Yeah, and then it wasn’t until later that I started connecting with a couple professors and that allowed me to kinda, at least continue taking classes in a particular major.

Tiffany: Are there particular professors that work as examples of that, or that you remember later or different like subject pathways, like kinds of courses at UWL that stick out to you all these years later as one of those places where you felt like you went from being, as you were saying, a Social Security Number to being a person, like a mind that was being respected and interacted with or something?

Darlene: Yeah, interacted with for sure. I would say, yeah, listening class. I can picture his face, I can’t remember his name now. I remember that listening class was really a powerful class for me. I also remember interpersonal communication. That was a really powerful class. That became my bread-and-butter class at the Portland State University too, I taught that with over a hundred people in it. I know. [Darlene laughs] And then, the other classes that really started getting fun for me, and it’s the theater professors who I remember the most like Dr. [A. Richard] Tinapp, and [Dr.] Ron[ald J. Stoffregen] and [Dr.] Kelly [D. Allison] , and of course [Dr.] Joe [Anderson] and [Dr.] Mary [(Leonard) Anderson], who just retired from UWL last year. So I was in [Dr.] Joe Anderson and [Dr.] Mary Leonard [Anderson], we, my friends and the people I connected with in theater were among their very first group when they first started at UW-La Crosse as professors. So, they were young like us, or at least they were a little bit older than us, right. And so, we connected, I connected in theater, again it was a hands-on thing. I could have a community of people who were interesting and fun and smart and welcoming. But that was where I found community, I think, in the academic setting was in the theater department.

Tiffany: Can you, oh what was I gonna, I just lost my follow-up question that I was going to ask. Oh, the thing I was thinking about is, I’m fascinated by the way that you were describing different moments in your early time at UWL where you’re thinking maybe this is the career path. Maybe this is the career path. Maybe this is the career path. And you ended up with a degree in speech communication and theater. Can you talk a little bit more about the process of interacting with advisors or not, or like what the, what the way to, what the way was that you ended up declaring your actual major that you graduated with and how that process all worked out? Cause I’m fascinated to know there could have been all these different like versions of you that came out of [Tiffany laughs] UWL.

Darlene: Right, right.

Tiffany: And yet, this is the speech communication and theater is where you ended up.

Darlene: Yeah, yeah, that’s kind of a wild moment. So, I had been going to school for five years. I had been passing my classes. You know, I think once I had hooked onto a couple professors, they would just say “Well maybe you should take this class, maybe you should take that class.” So I would just do what they told me to do. And then after about five years I thought oh gosh, I should try to get out of here, I mean how long do I really stay? So I went to the fourth floor, which I think is the third floor because the basement was so important. It was like the fourth floor of the Fine Arts building. Up on the fourth floor, I went to, I remember her first name was [Dr.] Carol [R. Berteotti]. She was sitting in her office smoking a cigarette up there. And I’d seen her and knock on the door and I said, “Hey can I talk to you about something?” and she said, “Sure. Sure. Come in.” “When do I get to graduate?” I said, “I’ve been going five years and I passed my classes and yeah, I think I’d like to graduate pretty soon.” And she said, “Well you need to pick a major.” And so, I said, “Ok, well how do I do that?” And she handed me a paper catalog, a big fat book, and that weekend I went home and I wrote down every single class that I’d ever taken and I put the grade next to it and the credits. And then I looked through the catalog and I tried to do a matching exercise as best as I could with all the majors to try to figure out what I was closest to, and it turned out I was closest to speech communication. And I needed a minor, so it turned out I was closest to theater. And so, I saw a year out to finish. Which would have been six years in total. But from when I graduated in, you know, basically ‘88 to ‘93 is five years. But the way I went summers and I picked up extra credits and things because I felt some sort of pressure like it was supposed to be a four-year degree. And most of my friends who I’d known since moving into the dorms had graduated already. So I was pretty much, you know, I didn’t find my people until my fifth year. And that was okay because they’re still my people today. So yeah, that’s how I graduated. Or that’s not quite how I graduated but that is how I saw my path to graduation. Yeah.

Tiffany: The other question I had been thinking about because you, in two different ways and two different pieces, you came back to that conversation with the education professor where you were describing like a conversation that’s happening in class, a meaning of the mind that continued past the technical end of the class and it seems like he, as well as some of your, the folks you were working with in theater, had an impact on you. If it’s, you know, thirty-plus years later and you’re still sort of remembering them fondly. I wonder, thinking about those examples or other favorite moments, intellectual moments of your college career at UWL, what do you think the characteristics of those faculty members that you were working with were that made such a conducive learning experience? Or what was it about them as professionals, what was it about your connection with them as part of a class or in the theater program that resulted, yeah, in remembering them all these years later?

Darlene: Oh certainly. Well, they knew my name. They identified strengths that I didn’t necessarily know were in me and asked me to participate with those strengths in ways that had a shared purpose among community. I was able to offer my thoughts in ways that felt genuine and authentic but also make mistakes and rethink what I thought was going on based on the conversation and change my mind now about certain things or ideas. I remember I was the props master for Noises Off and [Dr.] Ron[ald J. Stoffregen] told me I needed a plate of sardines that fell off the second floor of the set and flew down into the actors below on stage and I was like, “How would I ever do that?” And so he said, “I think you can figure it out.” So I just, I went to the Ace Hardware, I went to the fishing store, I went to the, you know, well how can I figure this out? And I figured it out, how I would get sardines to fly off of a plate from the second floor and fall down onto the actors below, and they were slippery enough, right? And so [Darlene laughs] it just, like something that silly that I really got to think about how to create part of the scene, a very small part of the scene, it was just a prop, right, on stage that would have the effect in a farce such as Noises Off. So that was a, you know, kind of an example, I guess. Or with Dr. [Robert L.K.] Richardson in the education class where he would set us up with some philosophical questions that didn’t necessarily have right or wrong answers, but that begged not only the literature that we were assigned, the readings we were assigned, but also that conversation with other peoples’ experiences to bring out what in the educational system might be beneficial or detrimental in the practice of tracking, and that particular topic. But that was a big example. He did that on a regular basis, would set us up with some discussion groups and questions that didn’t necessarily have a right or wrong answer.

Michelle: I absolutely felt more connected to them because for whatever reason the class sizes were smaller, probably because we were in our major. And they were just very, I mean, if you went up and asked a professor a question after class, they would talk forever, help you with whatever. I don’t remember going to their office hours per say. I don’t even know if that was a thing, but they were always available. I mean, if you asked them a question and they didn’t know the answer they would, you know, set up a time to meet with you or visit. I mean, hey I don’t know, they were always available. And in fact I wasn’t the only person that would ask questions after class. So they just- you just kind of waited your turn and they stayed long. I don’t ever remember any of them ever saying, “I have to go.”      

Kevin: Okay, so what you’re saying is like once you got into like the classes for your major, your professors seemed a lot more open to you? 

Michelle: Oh yeah, definitely. Cause they’re all education majors, you know. Or at one point and they all, you know, knew your questions were legit and yeah definitely. Definitely more more inviting, more. Class sizes were smaller, helpful. You know, they were very passionate about what they were doing. [Chuckles]